Questions with Answers
Sitemaster comment: If you can think of some Q & A's that haven't been included, please feel welcome to let me know, and they'll be added to this listing.
Side notes: The abbreviation "MTMS" indicates...you guessed it. Writing out "The Mary.....Show" every time would have been too unwieldy. If you are looking for the answer to a specific question, try using the 'FIND' function on your browser. Go up to the toolbar and select 'EDIT' and then select 'Find' or 'Find on this page' and then type in a name or phrase. Example: If you want to know whether or not Ted Knight liked his character, type in 'Ted Knight' for one search and 'hate' or 'like' for another. Your browser will scroll down to the appropriate information.
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Minneapolis
(1) Why Minneapolis? A few reasons. First, it opened up a few story possibilities (people getting stuck in snow drifts, the conflicts snow and cold weather can cause--both indoors and outdoors). They could have it snowing outside Mary Richards' window, which was effective. The primary reason for centering the show in Minneapolis was this: it showed that there was life in places other than New York and California! Hell, it ain't all about LA, New York, and Philly!
(2) Was Mary's second apartment building an actual high-rise in Minneapolis ? Yes! The name of the building is Cedar Square West, and it is still there today. The stock footage of Mary's second residence was this building. It's located on (or near) the West Bank in Minneapolis, and can be seen as you're travelling on 35-West.
(3) Is the building where WJM-TV was housed a real building in downtown Minneapolis? Yes. Unfortunately, the name of the building has changed once or twice over the last 20 or so years. In the show, the building was known as The Snyder Building, because it was owned by the president of Snyder Publishing Co., who also had offices in that building. Recall: Snyder Publishing was the firm that Phyllis tried to get to publish Bess' book called "The Care and Feeding of Parents".
(4) Is the stock footage of the apartment house for real, or were they set designs? It's for real! The house is located in Minneapolis on Kenwood Parkway. Have a look at Russ' Photos!
(5) Is that shopping mall where Mary and Bess window shop still around? Yes, it certainly is. But it isn't in Minneapolis. The shopping mall and bridge that Mary and Bess walk across can be found in Century City, just outside of Beverly Hills. The mall has been significantly remodeled...well, it has been thirty years, after all!
For fans of the show
(1) What did the critics think of the show? They hated it at the very first...Ted was a buffoon, Lou was a boozer, Rhoda was a man-eater, Phyllis was an annoying bitch, in their opinion. But that all subsided pretty quickly, and by the time the second season rolled around, they loved it dearly.
(2) Why didn't "Mary and Rhoda" become a series? Actually, plans were made in late 1997 for a new series, and it was publicized that a new series would start the next year. Anywhere from six to twelve scripts were written, but neither Mary nor Valerie was happy with them, and the plans went back to the shelves. In 1999, the idea of doing a TV movie was asserted, and was filmed that fall.
(3) Why was there NO reference to any of the MTMS characters on "Mary and Rhoda"? They didn't want to talk about them, evidently. Since "Mary and Rhoda" was supposed to be about "new beginnings", not "old times and old friendships", they felt it best not to mention the characters. There was a lot of griping about this, and it certainly would have made the below-average-rated TV movie much better.
(4) Where can reruns of MTMS be found? Check TV Land and Nick at Nite for the schedules.
(5) Are there any good websites on MTMS? Rhetorical question! Check the links page for other websites. There are a number of "in progress" and "abandoned" pages out there, and some of them do have some useful information. You can find the links to them on nearly all the search engines, since many of them have been around for three or more years.
(6) Are the versions of MTMS that air on cable TV edited? Yes, but from what we can tell, no full scenes have been deleted, just bits of dialogue here and there.
(7) What books are available about MTMS/the cast? There are a few on the Show. Check the Booklist for details. The best one is "Love is All Around: The Making of "The Mary Tyler Moore Show"" by Irby Brown and Bob Alley. There are a few more out there by other authors which have been out of print for some time. Supposedly one is being written/has been written recently by Sylvia Stoddard, but details are few and far-between. Mary Tyler Moore, Valerie Harper, Betty White, and Grant Tinker have all written their autobiographies. Valerie's book is supposed to be released early in 2001.
(8) Did Mary wear a wig, or was it her own hair? Mary wore a large, heavy, cumbersome wig for the first season or so. After that, her own, beautiful hair can be observed.
(9) Is MTMS on DVD yet? Yes, Season 1 is out. It was released in August 2002. However, Season 2 and subsequent seasons have been delayed due to lack of sales of Season 1. Hard to believe....
Production
(1) Why didn't Carl Reiner and John Rich produce MTMS? After all, they produced Mary's last hit, "The Dick Van Dyke Show". Jim Brooks and Allan Burns had a few differences with Grant Tinker in the early days of the show, and at one point, Tinker made the comment, "Carl Reiner wouldn't do it this way." They replied, "Grant, if you don't like how we're doing things, then maybe you should get Carl Reiner." But Tinker had confidence in his young directors and let them work their magic. The prolific comedy director John Rich (house director of "Van Dyke Show" and "All in the Family") was given scripts for "All in the Family" and "The Mary Tyler Moore Show" in 1970. Mary very much wanted the perfectionist Mr. Rich to direct her new series, and he seriously considered accepting the offer. While the premise of the Mary show was relatively straightforward, "AITF" seemed unusual and Rich wanted to see just where it would go. If it didn't work out, he promised to join Mary later. Of course, it worked out amazingly well and he couldn't leave "AITF".
(2) Why didn't Jim Brooks and Allan Burns write many more episodes? The creators usually don't write more than the first share of shows on a series, especially if they're also executive-producing the program. The producers are always part of the story conferences and script read-throughs, but they don't often have time to write entire scripts. They did contribute significantly to the rewrites of nearly every script ever filmed and were always on hand in rehearsals to make sure that the lines were playing smoothly. Truth be told, a lot of times scripts read very well but play lousy. Jim and Allan were supposedly fantastic at identifying problems in already very well-written scripts. Brooks and Burns did write a handful of early episodes, and they both contributed to "The Last Show".
(3) Where was the opening montage filmed? On location, in Minneapolis. Mary walks along the Lake of the Isles and throws her hat on the corner of 7th and Nicolet St. She rides an escalator, window shops, and eats lunch with Grant Tinker in the Crystal Court shopping mall. The street lamps with the characteristic design seen in the closing frames were taken down in 1992, replaced with some more updated models. Have a look.
(4) Was the casting for the show good, compared to other shows? Some highly competent character actors were hired for the parts. The casting was as good as or better than most shows on TV at that time.
(5) Were all the MTM Enterprises shows filmed on the same lot as "I Love Lucy" and "The Andy Griffith Show" and "The Dick Van Dyke Show"? No. Those three shows were shot on the Desilu lot soundstages on Culver Blvd. and Cahuenga Blvd. The MTME shows, especially the later ones including "Hill Street Blues" and "Remington Steele" were shot in many different locations.
(7) What was CBS's beef with divorce?! In the late sixties, the divorce rate in America was skyrocketing, and the networks did not see anything funny about divorce. There was also concern that it would look like Mary had divorced Dick Van Dyke, for some reason. It was likely that Grant Tinker had to fight a battle or two with CBS in order to convince them that it would all work. Nowadays, divorce is usually portrayed as something to laugh about. In fact, the network was taking quite a gamble by even allowing Mary Tyler Moore to do her own show. She'd scored stardom on "Van Dyke" as a perky housewife. She made two extremely forgettable films ("Change of Habit" and "Thoroughly Modern Millie") and had a Broadway play bomb out before it even opened. For some reason, they were willing to take a gamble with her and see what resulted. They got far more than they'd hoped for!
(8) Is the stock footage of the office building where WJM-TV resides an actual office building? Yes, and it's located in downtown Minneapolis.
(9) Who created MTMS? Creators: James L. Brooks and Allan Burns. Why Brooks and Burns? Grant Tinker made them a team. They'd worked together somewhat on the 1960's series "Room 222" and he thought they'd be a winning combination. And he was right. Boy, was he right.
(10) Which network aired "Mary and Rhoda"? ABC.
(11) Was the show filmed before a studio audience? Yes. MTMS, "Rhoda", "The Bob Newhart Show", and all the sitcoms were. Grant Tinker: "On Friday nights, I used to make my rounds to all the different shows, and witnessed a helluva lot of good television being made." They wouldn't dare use a laugh track!
(12) What network aired MTMS? CBS. MTM Enterprises had established ties with them early on, since they were the network that wanted Mary Tyler Moore to have her own show.
(13) Where was MTMS filmed? Sound Stage 2 at CBS Studio Center in Studio City, California. Trivia: this soundstage was previously occupied by the cast and crew of a highly undistinguished sitcom called......"Gilligan's Island" !!! Natalie Shafer, who played Mrs. Thurston Howell III, guested on one episode of Cloris Leachman's spinoff "Phyllis".
(14) Was the pilot episode of MTMS shown to a "guinea pig" random sampling of viewers? Yes. And most of them didn't like the show at all. Some thought Mary was a boring loser, and Lou Grant an abrasive boozer. The pilot had a vastly different set. It was shot with one camera, not three, and had a laugh track.
(15) What was the difference between an MTM Enterprises comedy and a Norman Lear comedy? The Lear comedies were socio-political examinations ("All in the Family") and/or racially based ("The Jeffersons"). His other comedy shows ("Maude", "Mary Hartman, Mary Hartman" and others) were nowhere near as good as the MTM Enterprises comedies. They were also videotaped, not filmed. Until "WKRP", all of the MTME shows were filmed. Supposedly "WKRP" was done on tape because music clearances were far cheaper for videotaped shows than for filmed ones.
(16) How did MTMS come to be created and why? A variety special on CBS in 1969 called, "Dick Van Dyke and The Other Woman" was extremely well received. Dick and Mary were so identified as Rob and Laura Petrie that whenever Dick went out in public with his real wife, Marge Van Dyke, everyone always wondered where Mary was! It was at that point that CBS decided that Mary should have her own show. She'd undergone several blows to her career since the cancellation of "Dick Van Dyke" in 1966, the worst of which was a Broadway play version of "Breakfast at Tiffany's" that never made it to opening night. Eventually, a deal was made to produce 13 episodes for CBS under the exclusive control of Grant and Mary.
(17) Was MTMS shot on videotape or film? Film, thankfully. They could have gone the budget route and saved tens of thousands of dollars per episode, but they didn't.
(18) Did Jim Brooks and Allan Burns write up their proposal for the show? If so, whatever happened to it? It's still around...well, photocopies of it are still around. The complete proposal can be found right here.
(19) What happened on opening night of "The Mary Tyler Moore Show"? A bomb dropped! The audience didn't respond well at all. Mary went home in tears, fearful that all the money they'd invested in the project might be lost. Grant Tinker ordered Jim Brooks and Allan Burns to "fix the problem, fast!" and they did.
(20) Why did the MTMS production staff choose to cancel the show? The writers, directors, and producers felt that they had successfully taken all the characters down all the roads they could. They didn't want the show to get stale or start revisiting areas they'd already visited before years ago, and decided to go out on top.
(21) Why didn't Lou and Mary get married?! Edward Asner was all for the idea. And it was certainly a reasonable idea. But it was voted against because they wanted to leave Mary Richards as a fully-blossomed, resilient career woman who was now ready to move to the next phase of her life and career. Surely the writers could have worked up a good final episode that involved them getting hitched, but it would have been a cop out. Mary Richards had made it after all, just as the song says, and leaving the audience with the impression that she'd become a married woman would have been a cop out. While Lou Grant had certainly become her closest of friends, neither was comfortable with the thought of them becoming lovers. In "Lou Dates Mary", the second-to-last episode, it is Mary who says that she'd like to date Lou, and she asks him out. Cut to the chase: they attempt a kiss and can't even get through it without giggling. They love each other dearly, but going to bed was simply not in the cards. There was talk of having the beginnings of a love scene, then having the light go out and Mary wail, "Ohhhh, Mr. Grant!"
(22) Was Mary's real-life husband the head of MTM Enterprises? Yes. Grant Tinker left MTME in 1981. He had become a CEO at NBC and the network's board did not want a conflict of interest (since he might only buy only MTME shows). Tinker reluctantly sold his shares of MTME to Arthur Price. The company disbanded around 1990 and was sold to Twentieth Century Fox. More about this can be found in Tinker's autobiography "Tinker in Television".
(23) How long was MTMS on the air? Seven years, from the fall of 1970 until the spring of 1977.
(24) How much money did each cast member make, per episode? Only an estimate: around $80,000 each. Henry Winkler was making around $60,000 per episode in the late 1970's on "Happy Days"; the MTMS cast members were making at least that, probably more.
(25) Who did the casting for MTMS? Several people, but the lady who deserves nearly all the credit was one Ethel Winant. When the show began pre-production in early 1970, Jim Brooks and Allan Burns were urged to hire her to do find the supporting cast for Mary. She had, at the time, casting agencies on both American coasts. She had Cloris Leachman in mind for Phyllis from the very beginning. "Cloris was Phyllis," she says. She attended a play that Valerie Harper was doing in New York and asked her to come read for the part. Ted Knight was also her idea of Ted Baxter. Ed Asner was Grant Tinker's idea for Lou, however, and today Ethel Winant thanks her lucky stars for that idea. Ms. Winant did the casting on the show for the first season or two, maybe more. Oddly, her name was never on the credits of the show. The reason: she was also head of casting at CBS at the time and it could be that she didn't want anyone to know she was doing as much as she was for MTMS. Meryl O'Loughlin was the casting supervisor for most of the show's run.
(26) Is MTMS available in foreign languages/is it broadcast in other countries? It is not currently available on videotape/DVD in any foreign languages. It has been broadcast off and on in other countries periodically (perhaps with subtitles) but to our knowledge other countries have not had a significant interest in broadcasting reruns.
The Episodes
(1) Why were Mary's parties so bad? Simple answer: because they made for some *great* comedy. But also, Mary Richards had to have at least one or two big faults that others could 'pick on'. And over the course of seven years, she got a lot of ribbing about it. Lou and Sue Ann were probably the biggest ribbers. "Mary Midwife" was an episode with a moderately bad Mary party. When Ted gets off the phone with the doctor after describing Georgette's labor contraction symptoms, he says, "Don't worry, the doctor says this could drag on for days", to which Sue Ann replies, "Apparently he's been to Mary's parties." And if you listen closely, you can hear the studio audience boo and gasp at the insult upon understanding the sarcastic allusion.
(2) Why the episodes with Betty Ford, Walter Cronkite, and Johnny Carson? Who knows? The three certainly had nothing to gain from MTMS at all, and were not connected with it in any way. Their appearances were welcomed immensely, though. It was a stroke of genius to have Johnny Carson make an appearance at the granddaddy of Mary's bad parties; Johnny himself suggested that the lights be out, to make his appearance all the more interesting.
(3) Which episode does the line "You know what, you've got spunk!" come from? The very first one, Episode 1.1, "Love is All Around", which originally aired September 19, 1970.
(4) What are some other best lines and quotations in the series? Here's a few of the best...well, more than a few.
LOU: I asked the marriage counselor how he was qualified to counsel Edie and me when he wasn't even married. He replied, 'You don't have to be a whale to write Moby Dick.'
TED: Let's see...thirty students at three hundred dollars apiece...that's, that's....that's thirty dollars!
LOU: Do you have thirty thousand dollars, Ted?
TED: Oh, you mean in the bank?
LOU: Mary says I should lose weight.
SUE ANN: Nonsense, Lou. Your body is perfect, I wouldn't touch it. If I did, I wouldn't stop!
LOU: Mary, do you think a single raw carrot would put any more ugly fat on me?
MARY: (very sarcastically) Not if you stuck it in your nose.
SUE ANN: Mary, believe me, I'm proud that you haven't been disheartened by those who murmur that you've sacrificed your femininity to your ambition.
MARY: Uh, gee, Sue Ann, I haven't heard anyone murmur that!
SUE ANN: Then I'm the first!!!
MARY: I'm...hardly innocent. I've been around. Well, maybe not "around", but I've been nearby.
SUE ANN: Dear Lou. Dear, cryptic, bashful, dirty-minded Lou!
TED: Wake up! Eat your breakfast! Driiiiiive to work! Say hello to your friends! Work at your job! Eat lunch! Work some more! Say goodbye to your friends! Drive home. Eat dinner! Sit down, read a magazine, and go to sleeeeeeeeeep!
SUE ANN: Why buy day-old bread, when he can have a cupcake, piping hot from the oven?
MURRAY: Yeah, but how many times has it been re-heated??
RHODA: (on Sue Ann) I love her dimples. I wonder if she made 'em herself.
RHODA: G'morning! Everybody got their birds and bees sweatshirts on today?!!
PHYLLIS: Lars said to me, 'Darling, don't you think it would be good if you cut down on your spending a little?' and I said to him, 'Darling, why don't you go suck an egg.'
PHYLLIS: I think Lars summed it up best when he turned to me one night and said, "Phyyyyyllis, yaak hartuuuta." I guess that's all over now. Did you know that the male bee is the slave of the queen? And after the male bee has, uh, how should I say, 'serviced the queen', the male dies. All in all, not a bad system.
MARY: (her final speech from "The Last Show") - I just wanted you to know that sometimes I get concerned about being a career woman. I get to thinking my job is too important to me, and I tell myself that the people I work with are just the people I work with. And not my family. And last night, I thought, 'what is a family, anyway'? They're just people who make you feel less alone and really loved. And that's what you've done for me. Thank you for being my family.
(5) Why the racial epithets in some episodes? Signs of the times. The worst ones came from the episode "Mary's Delinquent" when Sue Ann talks about her new young friend, Celestine Watkins (even the name is a racial slur of sorts). "I've got a little sister, too! And MINE'S BLACK!" She also says, "I'm cooking these collard greens, black-eyed peas and ham hocks with a bernaise sauce that makes the whole thing....palatable." And later, "Oh, it was just wonderful seeing the white guys stick it to the honkies!" The second season episode "Some of My Best Friends are Rhoda", which guest starred Mary Frann, had a chilling scene wherein Joanne Forbes accidentally admits how she feels about Jews. Some say that this episode echoed the Norman Lear Show story format and didn't really belong on MTMS.
(6) Why do we hear so much about this "Chuckles Bites the Dust" episode? What's it about and why is it so famous? For those of you who haven't seen the episode, it's about Chuckles the Clown, who has had a TV show on WJM-TV for many years. We first saw Chuckles in episode 1.8, "The Snow Must Go On" and he popped in periodically from then on, or was spoken of by Lou, Murray, Mary, or Ted. Chuckles' real name was George Bowerchuck (Ted dated his daughter, Betty Bowerchuck for awhile). There's a circus parade held in town every year, and Chuckles is elected to be the grand marshal. He goes to the circus parade dressed as Peter Peanut, one of the characters he plays on his show. A rogue elephant mistakes him for a real peanut, and "shells him to death". Plans then begin for his funeral. Murray writes an obituary; Ted gives him a tribute on the News. During all this planning, Lou, Murray, and Sue Ann, led by Murray, make jokes and giggle about Chuckles' death. Mary goes along with it for a short time, but grows increasingly uncomfortable with their disrespect. They all attend Chuckles' funeral, and the jokes quickly come to an end. But when the Reverend starts talking about Chuckles' life and work, it is *Mary* who completely loses it and lapses into hysterics. She has great difficulty stifling her laughter, and the Reverend asks her to stand up. She earnestly does so, and then he invites her to laugh out loud for Chuckles. Instead, she suddenly breaks into full wail and cries her eyes out.
The episode is considered the best TV episode of all time, and it deserves that billing for one reason only: Mary's performance. The story idea itself is good, but by no means outstanding. The events that led up to the production of the episode were harried. Jay Sandrich didn't want anything to do with the script; he took one look at it and decided to take the week off. The chores were farmed out to Joan Darling, an actress and director, who ultimately won an Emmy nomination for her work on the episode. During the early part of the week, Ed Asner, Betty White, Gavin MacLeod, Ted Knight, and Mary all found the script very funny. They chuckled and giggled at David Lloyd's script and the goofy premise. But by the end of the week, all except Mary had abandoned their chorteling fun. By Thursday evening, Mary was in very, very bad shape, and the rest of them asked if there was anything they could do for her, to help her stifle her grins. She certainly couldn't laugh in front of the studio audience on Friday night. By the time the show was filmed, she'd managed to contain herself. Had she smirked just once, the audience would have been confused by Mary Richards' reaction to the whole situation and multiple takes would have had to be done to patch the piece together. Her performance in the funeral sequence, filled with awkward stammers, gyrations and gesturing, is a performance for the ages. Mary: "It was a test for me, a test to see if I was really capable of upholding the show that bore my name." For a quick look at this scene, pop in your videocassette tape or look at the Glimpse page.
(7) What was the award-winning episode "The Lars Affair" all about? It's about an affair that takes place between Lars and Sue Ann (although we never see Lars) that Phyllis learns about by accident. The script does have some good dialogue, but was Cloris Leachman's brilliant acting that propelled it to classic status.
(8) How many episodes of "The Mary Tyler Moore Show", total? One hundred sixty-eight, over seven seasons, making an average of 24 per season, which is exactly how many per season were produced!!
(9) What signalled "the beginning of the end" of MTMS? It started in "Ted's Change of Heart", an early episode in the final season. Mary, Murray, and Lou all tell how they feel about each other. But behind the cameras, there was a building tension all through the seventh year, because they knew that it would be their last together.
(10) What are some other highly popular episodes in fan circles? "Ted Baxter's Famous Broadcasters School", "Lou's First Date", "Room 223", "Happy Birthday, Lou!", "Toulouse-Lautrec Is One of My Favorite Artists", "The Dinner Party", "The Lou and Edie Story", "Edie Gets Married", and of course, the first and last episodes, "Love is All Around" and "The Last Show".
(11) What are the most unpopular episodes? The worst episodes? There are some great episodes of MTMS that aren't so well known including "Mary's Delinquent", "Two Wrongs Don't Make a Writer", "My Brother's Keeper", "Not a Christmas Story", "Farmer Ted and the News", "A New Sue Ann" (the episode that dovetailed "Rhoda's Wedding" when it first aired). There are a very few episodes that people have mildly railed against. "The Ted and Georgette Show" seems a little weak. "Ted's Moment of Glory" offers the gold-digging Ted an opportunity to make five or ten-thousand dollars a week, and he doesn't take it. "Mary's Three Husbands" is a fantasy about Lou, Murray, and Ted becoming Mary's husbands that just plain bombs. Other than those few, MTMS pumped out outstanding...or at least *good* stories nearly every week.
Writers and Directors
(1) Did MTMS have what could be called "flawless writing"? Simple answer: it probably came closer than any other show in terms of consistently fabulous writing. No show is perfect; even the very greatest shows have duds. There were a few early episodes of MTMS and a few later ones that didn't fly very high. Check out the Episode Rankings page for more details. "I Love Lucy" would *probably* be in high on the list also, although some of the later episodes of that series and the hour-long "Comedy Hour" shows were pretty bad. Luckily, the MTMS writers didn't have Mary Richards taking long vacations to Europe! "The Wonder Years", to name a series produced nearer to the present, has been hailed as flawless.
(2) What themes were most prevalent on MTMS? Short-lived love and inter-character relationships (non-intimate, of course) were the main two.
(3) Were there themes that MTMS should have tackled but did not? Date rape, maybe?!! The writers pretty well hit all the bases; politics was left for "All In the Family", and it's good MTMS never made forays into that area, except on a purely comic level ("His Two Right Arms", "We Want Baxter").
(4) Who directed the most episodes? Jay Sandrich directed 128 out of the 168 episodes produced. Peter Baldwin, a highly competent director with a huge string of credits to his name, was in second place as director of ten episodes.
(5) Who was the most frequent male/female writer? David Lloyd wrote the most scripts of any writer (30 total). Many of Lloyd's scripts are among the best, and funniest, in the series ("Chuckles Bites the Dust", "Two Wrongs Don't Make a Writer", "Happy Birthday, Lou!", "You Sometimes Hurt the One You Hate"). Treva Silverman was the most frequently contributing of the female writers (15 total). She wrote "Divorce Isn't Everything", "Ménage à Phyllis", "The Lou and Edie Story", all highly comedic stories. Mary credits Treva for guarding and guiding Mary Richards' form with such expertise.
(6) Why were there so many female writers writing for the show? The simple answer: the women's lib movement. Jim Brooks, Allan Burns and Grant Tinker wanted as much creativity and realism on the show as possible, and they hired many up-and-coming women writers. It wasn't until the late sixties that women began writing for television, and MTM Enterprises was completely non-sexist when it came to getting quality scripts on the air. MTME gave them the freedom to work their magic in a "no holds barred" environment. Charlotte Brown only wrote one episode of MTMS, but in 1974 she started work on "Rhoda" as writer and story editor. Mary Kay Place, writer and actress, co-wrote "Mary's Delinquent", which aired in the sixth season. And the list goes on.
(7) Were there women directing? A few. Of the twenty-four individuals who directed over the seven years of MTMS, four were women. Marjorie Mullen, script supervisor for both "The Dick Van Dyke Show" and "The Mary Tyler Moore Show", directed four episodes. Nancy Walker (aka Ida Morgenstern), directed two episodes. Joan Darling and Mary Tyler Moore directed one episode each.
Characters
(1) Some say that MTMS had one too many characters with a strong Jewish influence. Why is that? Edward Asner is Jewish, although Lou Grant is not, and the vibes were there. The character Rhoda Morgenstern was from The Bronx and was Jewish. And let's not forget her mother, Ida, the greatest Jewish mother of all time. Again, the fact that the Jewish influence was somewhat rejected was a sign of the times. The series "Brooklyn Bridge", and to some extent "Seinfeld", were all about it.
(2) Why Charlene for Lou Grant? That was certainly interesting, wasn't it?! Instead of giving him another homely woman like Edie, they decided to unleash the fire that had probably been inside him for over thirty years, and give him a wilder woman. Sheree North was perfect for the part. Unfortunately, she joined the cast of another show and was unable to make more than three appearances.
(3) Why was the character of Georgette brought onboard? Rhoda was getting ready to spin off, and the show would be minus a character. Also, Ted Knight had, by the fourth year, grown increasingly unhappy with his character, Ted Baxter. He was becoming a bigger klutz with every episode, and to have him go on alone for years would have been insane; he needed a girlfriend. It was Mary Tyler Moore's idea to bring on a character like Georgette, a good looking blonde who would appear at one of Mary Richards' parties. Throughout the evening, she'd make several advances at Ted, and then perhaps they'd leave together. We don't know if Mary had in mind such a homely woman, but Georgia Engel did fantastically in her guest spot and by the end of the evening the writers knew they had something great in her.
(4) How much did Mary pay in rent when she first moved into 119 N. Wetherly Drive apartment? $130 a month. Make of that what you will.
(5) Why did Mary Richards move out of her original apartment? Jay Sandrich explains that the move "spiced up the proceedings quite a bit". After all, we'd seen her in that one-roomer with a hide-a-bed for five years. Now she was making more money and could afford a much nicer place (which supposedly had a swimming pool, tennis courts, and so forth). David Lloyd wrote the episode "Mary Moves Out", in which she undergoes a week-long slump. She feels that her life is becoming increasingly repetitive, like she can walk through a day blindfolded. Incidentally, this is the episode where Ted makes his big speech about how she should change her life, the one that starts out, "Wake up! Eat your breakfast! Driiiiiiive to work!" Mary decides to get herself a new pad and make a fresh start. But of course, the old digs wouldn't be forgotten.
(6) Who was the most unlikely candidate for Mary Richards' husband? Tom Vernon, played by Joseph Campanella (best known for his role on "The Fugitive"). He was much too old for Mary and they had absolutely no chemistry. Another bad candidate (although the episodes are hilarious) was Wes Callison, played by Jerry Van Dyke. Wes, former writer for Chuckles the Clown Show, makes two appearances, and Jerry Van Dyke does a splendid job in the role. Another particularly bad match was Tony Cramer from New York, whom Ida Morgenstern tries to match with Mary.
(8) Why did Lou and Edie break up? Lou's marriage to Edie was on the blink from the very beginning. The reason they broke up was because Edie hadn't really gotten to know herself. She admits to having married Lou at the tender age of 19, and shortly after became a housewife who always had Lou to fall back on. She wanted a chance to be her own person, to take risks and fail, to do things she'd otherwise never get a chance to do (who knows what they might be). In a way, she was doing what Mary Richards did, only she was doing it at a much older age. Instead of going back to Lou, she found another man who perhaps gave her the opportunity to be someone she couldn't be around Lou.
(9) Was Phyllis on every episode until she left to do Phyllis? No. Quoting Mary Tyler Moore: "That people think that Phyllis was on every episode of the show is a great tribute to Cloris Leachman. In fact, she never made more than six appearances per season."
(10) Why did Rhoda leave MTMS when she was doing so well? Fred Silverman, the great network exec, has the answer to that one. He saw the pilot episode of MTMS, and knew right then and there that he wanted Valerie Harper to someday leave and do her own series. They waited until Rhoda's character had developed fully, then they spun her off, which happened four years later. Rhoda Morgenstern could easily have come back into the fold if "Rhoda" had failed, no question about it. But who knows, MTMS could have burned out faster if she'd returned.
(11) Were the characters in the show political? It's never really asserted, but it would be pretty reasonable to suspect that Mary, Murray, Rhoda, Phyllis, and Georgette were very liberal. Lou coulda gone either way...he was from the old school, but I suspect he was probably more on the liberal side. Sue Ann...who knows. She was in her own, insulated little world of cooking and man-eating. Ted, no doubt, was conservative. Politics was never emphasized on MTMS as it was on "All in the Family" and other shows.
(12) Who was the most likely candidate for Mary Richards' husband? Hands down, Dan Whitfield, played by Michael Tolan. He was an intelligent college professor who was very well-suited to Mary's personality and needs. But of course, if the writers had married them, the series would have come to a screeching halt, like "Rhoda" almost did.
(13) Was Mary Richards promiscuous in the later years of the show, after she matured? During the later years of the show, Mary Richards was written as an extremely independent woman who dated regularly. Only in a couple episodes is it suggested that she slept with the man she happened to be dating, but no, she was never promiscuous. Most of her relationships are very short-lived (one to three dates, tops). It's interesting to see how Mary Tyler Moore matured as an actor, and concomitantly how Mary Richards grew into a woman who really had "made it on her own".
(14) Were the other characters ever viewed as promiscuous? Sue Ann Nivens was, to the point where she made it known that she'd slept with WJM-TV station manager Ed Schroeder in order to get her job. She and Lou spent a night or two together (that was the big secret that Mary told that nearly cost her her friendship with Lou). Rhoda Morgenstern had definitely been around, and in the conception of the show, Jim Brooks and Allan Burns were attempting to make it look like, "Mary is not a virgin, but Rhoda was not a virgin, many times over". But Rhoda never once gave the impression of being "easy" or slutty (although there are people who for some reason have that impression of her). She dated a lot of losers, which is asserted on a number of occasions. Lou sought a wild woman in Charlene McGuire after Edie dumped him, and she was a woman who had definitely had her share. Murray was happily married, as was Gordy, the weatherman. Phyllis talked about her "incredible love life" more than several times, saying how much she cherished her relationship with Lars. But just how incredible it really was...we don't know.
(15) How old were the characters and actors who played them? Mary Richards was supposed to be 30 years old when she first started working at WJM (Mary Tyler Moore was 33, almost 34, when the series started). Lou was supposed to be much older than he actually looked. He was a WWII vet, which would have made him born sometime around 1920. In fact, Edward Asner was born in 1929, which would make him a little young to be a WWII veteran. Phyllis was supposed to be 43 in "Ménage à Phyllis" in 1974...at that time, Cloris Leachman (b. 1926) was 48. Murray was in his forties, as was Gavin MacLeod (b. 1930). Sue Ann was in her fifties, as was Betty White (b. 1922). Rhoda was supposed to be a few years younger than Mary. (Valerie Harper (b. 1940) was 30 when MTMS started).
(16) Why didn't Mary get a lot of the funny lines and laughs? Because, to quote her, "I was the voice of sanity; I represented the audience." Mary Richards was not supposed to be, nor conceived to be, a side-splittingly funny person. She was a realist, an achiever, a flourisher. Ted Baxter, Lou Grant, Rhoda, and Sue Ann...and most of the other supporting cast, had the job of being funny. But if Mary had been a crack-up all the time, the show would have lost its spice very quickly. Instead, the humor comes out of Mary in the form of her mannerisms and the way she responds to others.
The Cast
(1) Were the cast members like the characters they played? Simple answer: no. Edward Asner has said that he used a lot of his older brothers in Lou Grant. Betty White has said that she didn't have very much of Sue Ann in her. Mary Tyler Moore was nothing like Mary Richards. Ted Knight was as much like Ted Baxter as an ocean is like a pond.
(2) Did the cast like the show? It's hard to say whether or not they all loved the show itself. Presumably they did, but their lives as cast members undoubtedly took a great deal of time and we don't know if they watched it all that much. Believe it or not, some television stars don't watch TV all that much, and some intensely dislike seeing themselves on screen. Jack Palance, a great actor who is best known for his performance as Mountain McClintock in Rod Serling's 1956 "Requiem for a Heavyweight", has never watched any of the movies or TV series' he's been in.
(3) Did the cast like the characters they played? Yes, with one glaring exception: Ted Knight hated Ted Baxter. The story goes that he came into Jim Brooks' and Allan Burns' office sometime during the third or fourth year and actually started crying over the situation. Jim wasn't there at the time, so Ted shared his feelings with Allan Burns. "I'm an educated, well-read man and I'm being identified with Ted Baxter, this stupid, ignorant jackass who's the butt of everyone's fun. I can't play him anymore," he basically said. Then Ed. Weinberger walked in and asked what was going on. The two men tried to console him and really knew they were in trouble if Ted left. Finally, Jim Brooks came in, and with a cheery grin shouted, "Hey, it's Ted, everyone's favorite schmuck!" Needless to say, the situation was quickly resolved.
(4) How come Cloris Leachman and Valerie Harper have not achieved the popularity of Mary Tyler Moore? Okay, so Valerie and Cloris aren't on the same par as Mary. But without them, TV would be considerably poorer!!
Valerie Harper has not had roles in many great feature films. Valerie made her start in the theater, where she is still very active today. She has, unfortunately, fallen victim to having her post-"Rhoda" TV shows cancelled. She underwent an ugly battle over "Valerie's Family" (renamed "The Hogan Family") in 1987...she won the lawsuit against the network, but the damage was done and she hasn't had a solid TV hit since. She is a great talent, however, and through reruns she remains as popular as ever.
Cloris Leachman hit it big with "The Last Picture Show" in 1971, and since then has appeared off and on in a number of lesser films, TV movies, and guestings on various TV series'. She'd done her share of superlative TV work for many years before MTMS. Prior to and during her years in TV, she too appeared in multiple successful theatrical productions. One could easily call her "the actor's actor". She may not be a household name, but she is a legend, no doubt about it.
(5) What were the cast members doing before they got jobs on MTMS? Ted Knight was barely making the rent. Mary hadn't had a solid hit since "The Dick Van Dyke Show". Valerie Harper was doing plays. Cloris Leachman was shooting "The Last Picture Show" around the time MTMS started, and also trying to raise a family and coordinate the builders and architects who were building a house for her large family. Gavin MacLeod was appearing off and on in guest spots on various comedy shows.
(6) Did any of the cast members go to college/hold college degrees? This is a plug: stay in school. Gavin MacLeod graduated from Ithaca College in 1952 with a degree in dramatic performance. Edward Asner attended Northwestern University and studied drama there. Valerie Harper attended Hunter College and went to New York School for Social Research. Harold Gould, who played Martin Morgenstern, holds a Ph.D. in drama from Cornell University.
(7) What was the cast's response to the end of the series? Mary says, "I had a lump in my throat for about three weeks afterwards." Betty White says, "I have yet to see the last episode without being under water!" Six weeks later, Mary held a dinner at Chasen's for the cast and crew, and they watched the show. When they got to the scene where Ed Asner said, "I treasure you people", there was a sob throughout the place that shook all of Beverly Hills. Indeed, everyone was saying goodbye to a show that had been much more than special. But it couldn't go on forever and they knew it, and the end had to come sooner or later. They all had lives to get on with, careers to soar higher in. And they all did.
(8) Do the cast get together today? Mary Tyler Moore and Valerie Harper are very close friends, but they don't see each other all that often. And despite the hatred between Rhoda and Phyllis, Valerie and Cloris Leachman are good friends. Mary and Betty White were friends well before the Show started, because Grant Tinker and Allen Ludden (Betty's then-husband) were longtime pals. The last time the entire cast got together as a whole was fourteen years later in 1991, for a CBS special wherein they discussed their experiences and personal feelings about the Show. None of them wanted to do a reunion special without Ted Knight, who died in 1986, which is understandable.
(9) Where did Gordy go? John Amos, who played Gordy for the first couple years, set sail from the MTMS soundstage and joined the cast of "Good Times" which gave him a regular role...on MTMS, he only showed up every now and again (several times per season). In retrospect, this was probably a good choice for the highly talented actor who was at that time in the process of fully launching his career. Amos returned in one of the last episodes, "Hail the Conquering Gordy".
(10) Were the cast members/production staff conservative or liberal? Hard to say for sure, but the production staff was probably very, very liberal. After all, they had women writers (and a lot of them) on board and they tackled women's lib issues. Edward Asner was ultra-liberal, and the same was probably true for most of the other cast members. They were all very well-informed citizens who often fought hard for what they believed in.
(11) Was Edward Asner President of Screen Actors Guild during the run of MTMS? No. That position didn't come until the early 1980's, and it brought with it some ugly political battles.
(12) Did Ted Knight feel like a second banana? Yes, he did. He was thirteen years older than Mary and by rights, he felt that the show should have been more of his. It would have helped if Knight had liked his character more; instead, he was having to play the idiot Ted next to the leading lady. And Mary Richards NEVER liked Ted Baxter.
(13) Did the cast like each other? The principal cast on MTMS loved each other dearly, and they had a remarkably harmonious working environment. Of course, there were on-set brawls from time to time, as there are on any show. Ted Knight and Ed Asner had a more than a few on-set squabbles, and they had periods during their friendship where they didn't speak to each other at all. Supposedly it was Ted who was more at fault for the fights, as Ed Asner has reported that Ted used to say outlandish things that eventually ate away at him. Who knows whether that's true or not. They always resolved the conflicts and were good friends until Ted died. In fact, at the time of Ted's death, they had once again become close. There were a few production brawls here and there, and in the early stages of production there were more than a few. All the cast not only respected each other as actors, but as people, and they were all good friends. Their company was the envy of nearly every other show on at that time, especially with regard to everyone working so harmoniously and getting along. That's probably why the final scene of "The Last Show" was so genuinely saddening...they were not acting at all and the tears were real. You don't find that on more than a very few other shows.
(14) Hobbies? Needlepoint was big on the set. Betty White, Georgia Engel, Mary and Valerie Harper all did knitting and needlework. It was Richard Deacon (Mel Cooley on "The Dick Van Dyke Show") who taught Mary how to do needlepoint.... uh, okay. All were very well-informed citizens who read the newspaper daily. Ed Asner sometimes used to work on jigsaw puzzles.
Mary and her show
(1) Did Mary Tyler Moore direct any episodes? Yes. Mary directed "A Boy's Best Friend", and she admits that she had virtually no idea what she was doing. Still, the episode came out okay, because by that time the cast was pretty well able to act on "auto pilot". They knew each other's sensibilities and timing, and probably didn't need a director at all.
(2) What are Mary's favorite episodes? "Chuckles Bites the Dust" and "Put on a Happy Face". The latter episode was the one where she accepted her Teddy Award in a torn dress, false eyelashes, smeared mascara, and a fuzzy slipper. Good choices, Mair!
(3) Was Mary Tyler Moore alcoholic during the days of the show? She has openly admitted that during the days of both "Dick Van Dyke" and her own show that she did drink regularly, but she was always very professional and it never interfered with her work. Her alcoholism came to a head in the early 1980s and she entered the Betty Ford Clinic for treatment. Today, she is a confirmed non-alcoholic. She also gave up smoking shortly after she quit drinking, and owing to her love for animals, she eventually gave up eating meat.
(4) Like Bob Newhart, Mary Tyler Moore was capable of a classic stammer. Was there a name for this stammering? Yes. Jim Brooks and Allan Burns called it "grentioning" and "fumphering". She used her classic stammer throughought her prolific years on TV, from 1961 to 1977.
(5) Is it true that Mary was disappointed that MTMS has not taken the years very well? There has been rumor of that, but Mary is extremely proud of the show, and knows that it still has a very loyal rerun audience. In fact, MTMS is usually ranked #1 in "best sitcoms" polls, even ahead of "All in the Family" and "I Love Lucy", which were #1 in the ratings for five or more consecutive years when they originally aired.
(6) When was it discovered that Mary could do comedy? Carl Reiner wrote an episode of The Dick Van Dyke Show called "My Blonde-Haired Brunette", directed by John Rich, early on in that series (in 1961). Mary was given a chance to do a Lucille Ball-style crying jag, which she reprised throughout the years, on through her Mary Tyler Moore Show days. The crying jag revealed her comedic genius. Lucy herself, the landlady and co-owner of Desilu Studios in those days, sometimes stopped by the Van Dyke Show set unannounced. She'd often go up on the catwalks and look down on the working actors and would let out a laugh at something she found funny. One day, Lucy came over to Mary and told her, "You're very good." High praise! Like Lucille Ball, Mary Tyler Moore is more of an introvert offstage.
Awards
(1) How many Emmys did MTMS win? Twenty-seven trophies and more than thirty nominations were earned by the cast and crew. See the Awards section of this site for more details.
(2) How many Emmys has Mary won? Seven, so far. Four were for her work on MTMS.
(3) How many Golden Globes did MTMS win? Three. One went to Mary in the first season; the other two went to Ed Asner in 1972 and 1976.
Bad Times on the MTMS Soundstages
(1) Was Betty Ford drunk when she made her guest appearance? Yes. Not too many details are available on this, but Betty was unhappy at the time and had pretty well lost most of herself to alcoholism. Shortly after, she evidently got help and eventually founded the Betty Ford Clinic.
(2) Were there any/are there any "haters" of MTMS? Of course, as is the case with any show. At first, the networks disliked the whole premise of the show, but after the first season, their doubts dissolved.
As for guest stars who worked on the set - nearly everyone in the industry held the show in very high regard, and most of the guests were usually welcomed openly. This was not always the case, however.
Jackie Cooper, the prolific producer, director, and actor, was active in television for six decades. He directed the great fourth season episode "You Sometimes Hurt the One You Hate". From the way it's described, the cast were lucky he didn't hurt them by the time the filming was completed! Mr. Cooper hated the working environment on MTMS, because it was far from what he was used to. Instead of simply directing the actors as he saw fit, he got a lot of interception from Jim Brooks, Marge Mullen, and others on the sidelines who would throw in suggestions for improvement. This was their modus operandi, and it was a nightmare for him. Jackie Cooper did direct a number of episodes of other MTM Enterprises shows, but that was the last time he came around the MTMS soundstage.
The late Vincent "Vince" Gardenia played Mr. Coleman, the new WJM-TV station manager in "The Last Show" who fires Mary, Lou, and Murray. For obvious reasons, this was perhaps the most problematic of the 168 episodes. The last work week was very difficult for the cast. Literally every staff member was depressed and crying throughout the rehearsals, and here was Vince...he didn't really know anyone on the show, and they all basically dragged him into their stupor. He later said, "I felt like a pork chop in a synagogue...I didn't know what to do with myself that week."
As aforementioned, Ted Knight and Edward Asner sometimes had personal struggles, but in the end, the two guys loved each other, spent time together, and laughed a lot together.
There were a couple actors who really got the cold shoulder from one certain cast member, who shall remain nameless. Both of these actors have reported to me that their experience on the set was (to quote one of them) "horrible." One of the last shows of the seventh season called for two guest-spot actors. Due to conflicts between this actor and one of the principal MTMS cast members, his scenes were cut out of the show. Another semi-regular performer on MTMS has stated that this same cast member was often unkind...and that it resulted in being written out of a few episodes and/or having some scenes deleted.
This same scenario could be found on many shows of the same era and in fact, the same thing continues today in both TV and film. On "All in the Family", the great Betty Garrett was not the first choice to play Irene Lorenzo, the Bunker's neighbor. The part was originally given to Sada Thompson (later of the TV show "Family" with Kristy McNicholl). After a week on the "All in the Family" set, Thompson packed up and left after getting the silent treatment and cold shoulder from star Carroll O'Connor. Betty Garrett was a friend of O'Connor's and he suggested she come in and play the part, which she did splendidly. This was particularly surprising, since O'Connor was usually very kind to everyone he worked with. Many years later, O'Connor reported that he never really felt like one of his co-stars was worthy of their place on the series, even though this particular actor too held O'Connor in high regard.
Odds and ends
(1) Just how reality-based is MTMS, compared to other sitcoms? Surprisingly realistic much of the time. Very little of the sitcom was contrived or "plastic" or surreal, with the exception of some of Ted Baxter's hilarious antics. The cast ensemble had good chemistry, and they all acted and reacted to each other very well. Nearly all the stories all come off as believable situations. Virtually every episode was a glimpse of a commonplace situation (for example, Lou selling his house) made comedic. In short, MTMS followed the format of 'situation comedy' astoundingly well.
(2) Was MTMS always at the top of the heap in the ratings? No. It only made the top ten for three out of seven years, and never made the top five! Hard to believe, eh?! Luckily it was in the top ten during what some call "the golden season of TV", 1973-74. That line-up included, "All in the Family", "M*A*S*H", "The Mary Tyler Moore Show", "The Carol Burnett Show". Now that's three hours worth of quality television!
(3) What was MTMS's number one rival show? Check the ratings page for more details.
(4) Was MTMS a steal off "That Girl"? Not really. "That Girl" was a silly show about a girl who depended on others for her happiness (her boyfriend, her father). Anne Marie (played by Marlo Thomas) was supposed to be a wild and crazy girl who "cut the ties loose". Mary has said that if it hadn't been for "That Girl", there would be no "Mary Tyler Moore Show". Interesting observation. MTMS was not really a steal, but it was in the same vein, definitely. So we can thank Anne Marie for blazing the trail, if nothing else.
(5) How was MTMS a groundbreaking show? It was the first show about a was making it/was setting out to make it on her own. She was determined to survive as a professional, independent woman, and she did. Since then, millions of women have modeled themselves after Mary Richards...perhaps. I'm not a woman, so I don't really know for sure. : )
(6) Why Minneapolis? Because it was *different*. It wasn't California, it wasn't New York. It didn't exactly open up a lot of story possibilities, but there were some elements, namely that of 'SNOW', that were used to good effect.
(7) What are the two most enduring aspects of MTMS?? Short and sweet answer: the importance of those you work with being your family (and for those of you who read this who don't work because you're too damn wealthy, at least get out there and volunteer for some good cause) and secondly, the long-needed recognition of the woman as an upstanding individual.
(8) Who was that woman with the sour face at the end of the opening credits? Her name was Hazel Frederick, and she passed away in late 1999 at the age of 91. In 1996, Mary met Hazel Frederick during a book signing in Minneapolis. Mary: "I extended my hand to her and I said, 'tell me, why were you scowling'? She said, 'I thought you were going to kill yourself, my dear!' " Here is a bit more information about her.
(9) Was Mary Tyler Moore's tossing her hat into the air the number one moment in television? Not quite! The top three: #1 was Kennedy's assassination. #2 was Mary's tossing the beret. #3 was "Who shot J.R.?"
(10) Was MTMS a controversial show? No, but there were some great reservations voiced in the early stages about using divorce as the catalyst of the show. They also objected strongly to the Jewish influence of Edward Asner and the character of Rhoda Morgenstern. Those two issues were the main ones; after Grant Tinker got the network to chill out, it was smooth sailing. MTMS was the envy of nearly every other show on television: great cast who always got along, great writing and production, great working method. Now, Norman Lear had to fight some bloody wars with "All In the Family", with the cast of the show as well as the network. That number one show was a major hit, but not without undergoing a behind-the-curtain fight nearly all the way through.
(11) What did TV Guide think of "The Mary Tyler Moore Show"? They hated it to begin with (check this out), and it was awhile before they really and truly warmed up to it. As the first season progressed, they did some close-ups on the show. After the first season, they did an average two big articles on the show every year.
(12) Are there any props or production artifacts left from the days of the Show? It is likely that Mary Tyler Moore has the big, golden 'M'...or perhaps that's in the Smithsonian Institute now. The sets used for the show might be around still...sometimes those things get saved for one reason or another.
(13) Is there any period memorabilia left out there? Lunch pails, Mary Richards dolls, studio audience tickets to the show...are probably out there. Check eBay to see if anyone is selling them. Failing that, antique collectors might have some on hand. This website will soon have t-shirts and mugs available for purchase.
(14) Was the WJM-TV newsroom operation similar to that of a real newsroom? Hardly. According to an article wherein a reporter from TV Guide screened a Minneapolis newsroom and asked them to compare their operation to that on MTMS, they admitted that WJM's was hardly an accurate representation. Sure, the writers did a good job of making it look authentic, but it was comparatively "tame" to *real* newsrooms. Check out this article for more details.
(15) What is Jennifer Aniston's connection to MTMS? Her father was considered for the role of Ted Baxter! OUCH!
(16) Trilogies on MTM Show? The Chuckles Trilogy: We heard about Chuckles from almost the very first show. We met him in the first season episode "The Show Must Go On", just briefly. He pops up again in a later episode when Lou becomes programming manager of WJM, but just briefly. Ted dates Betty Bowerchuck, his daughter, and he grows a mustache. He appears in his only notable appearance in "Son of But Seriously Folks" when Wes Callison quits as his head writer. In "Phyllis Whips Inflation", Phyllis wants a job on his show. And every now and then, his name pops up. Finally, Chuckles is killed off in the sixth season episode that bears his name, "Chuckles Bites the Dust" and that's the last we hear of him.
The Lou and Edie Trilogy: We hear about her almost from the very first show, as well. She appears for the first time in the second season. She and Lou are on the rocks continuously...they try marriage counseling, but it is unsuccessful and the therapist recommends they separate. They do, and in the fifth season they finally divorce. But Edie reappears a couple times - once to give Lou a birthday present and another at one of the many awards dinners. In the first episode of the sixth season, Edie remarries and that's the last we see or hear of her.
The Teddy Awards: This is the annual Television Editor's Awards banquet. It's a Minneapolis-only function, and means much more to some people than others. The first Teddy ceremony we see comes in the first season with the episode "Bob and Rhoda and Teddy and Mary". Ted never gets even so much as a nomination until he pays off the nominating committee to give him the award one year. Mary wins one on the night that follows a horrendously bad day (and Ted ends up as her date) - Sue Ann wins one for her special called "Cooking Fowl" - but Lou and Murray never quite win the award. In the last of the ceremonies seen, word gets out that Murray is going to win, but this turns out to be wrong information. Murray is humiliated as he goes to the podium before the host even calls the real winner's name, and starts to read his acceptance speech. But the moving tribute to Mary, Lou, and Ted is later heard back at Mary's apartment.
After the Fact
(1) Why did the subsequent "Mary" spinoffs and series attempts fail? Not all of them did! "Rhoda" was, by and large, a success. "Phyllis" failed due to lack of continuity of the Phyllis Lindstrom of Minneapolis and the Phyllis Lindstrom of San Francisco. She was a flighty busybody in Minneapolis, then seemed to drop that after moving to San Francisco, and it killed her. "The Betty White Show" and "The Ted Knight Show" (the latter was not an MTM Enterprises show) were simply done too soon after MTMS and the writing wasn't up to par. "Mary" and "The Mary Tyler Moore Hour" (1979), and the "Mary" shows of the 1980's were doomed from day one. Bad stories, bad writing, bad concepts. Golden rule: you can never do a great show a second time and have it be as great.
(2) What are the cast members all doing now? June, 2001: Cloris Leachman is still working very actively in feature films and guest appearances on various TV series'. Betty White is doing the same thing, and/or working on an animal rights movement project. Mary Tyler Moore recently completed filming of a TV movie called "Like Mother, Like Son: The Strange Story of Sante and Kenny Kimes" in Australia. In this TV movie she anxiously took on yet another austere role similar to her Beth Jarrett of "Ordinary People". Mary's strong commitment to animal rights is probably occupying some of her time, as well. She completed work on the feature film "Cheaters", to be released this fall. Gavin MacLeod is likely still working in Canada on a radio show with his wife, in attempt to get married couples to stay together. Edward Asner has his own production company, and continues to act in TV movies, feature films, and makes guest appearances on various TV shows. He had a part in the recently-released feature film "The Animal" (which Cloris Leachman also had a part in). Valerie Harper's autobiography, aptly titled "Today I am a Ma'am" (after the first season MTMS episode title of the same name) was released in May and in July 2001 she did a play on Broadway called "The Allergist's Wife". More details about her activities at Valerieharper.com. It's a shame that official sites aren't available for all the cast members; unfortunately, none of them are very internet-savvy.
(3) What about the spinoffs?! The three official spinoffs: "Rhoda", "Phyllis", "Lou Grant". "The Betty White Show" is, in a sense, a spinoff, but not per se. "Rhoda" and "Lou Grant" were the most successful of these. "Mary" (1985) and "The Mary Tyler Moore Hour" (1979) were not spinoffs, but bombed badly.
(4) Is MTMS today considered an icon? But of course, and it's referenced and spoofed all over the place. Some girl, from a distance, once shouted to Mary Tyler Moore, "You're an icon!"
(5) Are there any plans to get another show/special on MTMS on the air? There may be another "Mary and Rhoda" TV movie sometime, but that won't be for awhile yet. To quote Betty White, "We couldn't do a reunion without Ted!"
Well, that's all for now. If you're still searching for answers, get a copy of "Love is All Around: The Making of "The Mary Tyler Moore Show"" by Robert Alley and Irby Brown. This fantastic book is out of print, but is essential reading for anyone who wants to know everything about the Show.
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